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    Posted: 07/April/2015 at 9:24pm
Calderone 1372
Harris    1299
All precincts reported.

Mail-in/Absentee ballots yet to be counted.
"It is a wreave belief that we already are in Hell."- Tuluk in Frank Herbert's "Whipping Star"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KPO'M Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07/April/2015 at 11:47pm
Dead people usually vote for incumbents. At least Hosty is gone and Mannix barely held on. I'm back in the city where I'm more relieved than anything else that Rahm pushed back a challenge from the CTU aka Garcia. But I still pay taxes to D209 and Mayor Alarm Company.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote citizen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/April/2015 at 10:10am
still a political animal, i see :) 
don't have a clue what's in the mail-in/absentee bucket, mostly because voting habits are changing rapidly w/more options.
i still like to vote in person on election day, but that could change in four years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/April/2015 at 10:25am
Think maybe older voters tend to vote by mail, would probably be in the Mayor's favor but it ain't over till it's over.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote watcher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/April/2015 at 1:36pm
Originally posted by logic logic wrote:

Think maybe older voters tend to vote by mail, would probably be in the Mayor's favor but it ain't over till it's over.


It's problematic that the process isn't clear and known to all. It's problematic that only 31% of registered voters turned out. It's concerning that the outcome was affected by sabotage regardless of motive. It's troubling that there were fewer specifics outlined by the candidates. It's jarring that water was carried by arms-length operatives, then sliced and diced as though it represented a candidate's actual words or intent...

Not a banner day in election history.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/April/2015 at 1:59pm
What's evident is anyone who chooses to run for office, needs realize many choices made in their adult life, are accessible to whomever cares to look. "Operatives" need not stalk, demean or verbally abuse the other person's supporters.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote piehead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08/April/2015 at 3:53pm
And that the adult children of a candidate is allowed to roam free through the internet to intimidate and belittle people at will! Dirty dirty dirty.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09/April/2015 at 9:15am
Originally posted by watcher watcher wrote:

It's concerning that the outcome was affected by sabotage regardless of motive.
Do you think it's possible for a candidate, their operatives to sabotage their own campaign, watcher?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09/April/2015 at 10:59am
Originally posted by watcher watcher wrote:

Not a banner day in election history.

Think it's bad here, think again. Have a co-worker, smart guy, great with our peeps. He decided to run for mayor in Harvey, first they spray painted his little campaign office with the word LEAVE then they burned it out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote piehead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09/April/2015 at 3:09pm
That sucks; doesn't lessen what the opposition did here in our small village though. Politics are dirty, very dirty.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote watcher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09/April/2015 at 3:14pm
Originally posted by logic logic wrote:

Do you think it's possible for a candidate, their operatives to sabotage their own campaign, watcher?


Absolutely... Happens all the time. SEE: Mittens 2012 Palin 2008 Edwards 2004.

Most famously Nixon 1972




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KPO'M Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09/April/2015 at 7:03pm
Originally posted by watcher watcher wrote:

Originally posted by logic logic wrote:

Do you think it's possible for a candidate, their operatives to sabotage their own campaign, watcher?


Absolutely... Happens all the time. SEE: Mittens 2012 Palin 2008 Edwards 2004.

Most famously Nixon 1972



Clinton 2016?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote watcher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09/April/2015 at 8:42pm
Originally posted by KPO'M KPO'M wrote:

Clinton 2016?


Prediction or just wishful thinking?




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12/April/2015 at 8:14am
Originally posted by piehead piehead wrote:

That sucks; doesn't lessen what the opposition did here in our small village though. Politics are dirty, very dirty.
Which opposition, pie? Was obvious many GOOD people were in opposite camps, OK, but given human nature, can believe some of those same people decried the negative mailers aimed at their guy while licking their chops at those targeting the other. Did Mr Harris ever concede?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote watcher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13/April/2015 at 6:33am
Originally posted by logic logic wrote:

Did Mr Harris ever concede?


Would this be news? MATC already declared victory in yet another
squeaker. That's what matters, right?



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13/April/2015 at 10:40am
IMAHO, it would be news, it speaks to character.

Look, whether loved, despised or somewhere in between the Mayor and his record are out there, that's basically what he had to run on good and bad, fire away.

I don't know Mr Harris, is he that gregarious, hard-working, relevant guy, as promoted by his supporters? Didn't know he was in a "band" until told about it a few weeks ago, even then didn't know the name prior to seeing it in the Review. Took a look on YouTube, a few other sites, didn't like what I saw or the message. Very animated performances, anger, rage, violent lyrics, imagery.
One of my kids said "it's only music". true, don't have to like it but it left a bad impression. Knew I couldn't vote for the guy no matter how much distance his supporters tried to create between the man and his music that has been a large part of his life and after a yr off may be again.

The poor memory, over-explanation, affidavit, with a touch of whining thrown in, yadda, yadda, about his run-ins with the law were interesting. Why didn't he just tell the truth? It was long ago, cases are dismissed for many reasons. The heat of the moment fades away, plaintiffs don't show-up for court or there is no there there.

You're right, is was a squeaker, is it too late, too long for the message to sink in? Can fences can be mended?

One of your favorites, watcher, meet the new boss same as the old boss. I'm really not convinced the table set by Mr Harris would have been all-inclusive.







Edited by logic - 13/April/2015 at 10:44am
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Originally posted by logic logic wrote:

IMAHO, it would be news, it speaks to character.

Look, whether loved, despised or somewhere in between the Mayor and his record are out there, that's basically what he had to run on good and bad, fire away.

I don't know Mr Harris, is he that gregarious, hard-working, relevant guy, as promoted by his supporters? Didn't know he was in a "band" until told about it a few weeks ago, even then didn't know the name prior to seeing it in the Review. Took a look on YouTube, a few other sites, didn't like what I saw or the message. Very animated performances, anger, rage, violent lyrics, imagery.
One of my kids said "it's only music". true, don't have to like it but it left a bad impression. Knew I couldn't vote for the guy no matter how much distance his supporters tried to create between the man and his music that has been a large part of his life and after a yr off may be again.

The poor memory, over-explanation, affidavit, with a touch of whining thrown in, yadda, yadda, about his run-ins with the law were interesting. Why didn't he just tell the truth? It was long ago, cases are dismissed for many reasons. The heat of the moment fades away, plaintiffs don't show-up for court or there is no there there.

You're right, is was a squeaker, is it too late, too long for the message to sink in? Can fences can be mended?

One of your favorites, watcher, meet the new boss same as the old boss. I'm really not convinced the table set by Mr Harris would have been all-inclusive.


Since the "new" boss is the old boss, it's a certainty. We're not allowed the luxury of knowing, for sure, the quality of our mistakes.
Maybe someday? With enough data points there might be an app for that!

I'm pretty sure had things played out differently, FoPa would not be the hell-hole that was forecast by this or past campaigns. We've only been witness to MATC & Co. with its solid three beats two approach to leadership. That 70% of the voters were not concerned enough to weigh in, while the 30% who did were evenly split, may or may not speak to something. The presumption that non-involvement denotes tacit approval is an unwise conclusion.

"Oh-bla-di, Oh-bla-dah, life goes on, boy..." is fitting.

As to Chris Harris' character... it's intact. Older, wiser and battle-scarred. His voice need not be vanquished, especially if MATC was sincere about bridging our divides. But, as always, three beats two.

Any Harris "concession" would be a surrender to the fundamental wrongness of that school of political thought. Harris lost. He didn't get beat.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jerry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13/April/2015 at 2:40pm
Well, maybe MATC no longer feels as safe, there was a squad car parked accross the street from his house election night.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13/April/2015 at 2:50pm
Originally posted by watcher watcher wrote:


That 70% of the voters were not concerned enough to weigh in, while the 30% who did were evenly split, may or may not speak to something. The presumption that non-involvement denotes tacit approval is an unwise conclusion.

As to Chris Harris' character... it's intact. Older, wiser and battle-scarred. His voice need not be vanquished, especially if MATC was sincere about bridging our divides. But, as always, three beats two.

Any Harris "concession" would be a surrender to the fundamental wrongness of that school of political thought. Harris lost. He didn't get beat.


Conceding a lost election is NOT a surrender, except for maybe those with a limited mindset, it's an acknowledgement of REALITY. I presume nothing, about those who chose not to vote, whatever their reasons. Would you like to force people to vote?

Sure Mr Harris will remain "in character" no matter what his future holds. Maybe he can perform a song about severing the hands of people who didn't vote for him and the injustice of it all:)

Edited by logic - 13/April/2015 at 3:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote piehead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13/April/2015 at 3:58pm
Or Calderone can blame women for a police officer 'seducing him' after he gets them drunk! Yeah, that's much better.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote watcher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13/April/2015 at 4:15pm
Originally posted by logic logic wrote:

Conceding a lost election is NOT a surrender, except for maybe those with a limited mindset, it's an acknowledgement of REALITY. I presume nothing, about those who chose not to vote, whatever their reasons. Would you like to force people to vote?

Sure Mr Harris will remain "in character" no matter what his future holds. Maybe he can perform a song about severing the hands of people who didn't vote for him and the injustice of it all:)


Some elections don't offer much of a window for conceding. There was some confusion on election night as to what the "results" did and did not include. The mayor declared victory as soon as the last precinct numbers were posted, but we didn't know right away if those numbers included early votes, absentee and provisional ballots or what those numbers were.

NOBODY seemed to know anything for sure, so Harris' lack of concession should be understandable. The numbers still haven't been certified. That's not saying the outcome is in doubt, just that that the concession ship had sailed. Not sure where you got your script for how things have to be done, but I'd say you're looking for a slight that just isn't there.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14/April/2015 at 6:55am
Originally posted by watcher watcher wrote:

That's not saying the outcome is in doubt, just that that the concession ship had sailed. Not sure where you got your script for how things have to be done, but I'd say you're looking for a slight that just isn't there.
Had no expectation of an immediate concession (not surrender) while the numbers were in doubt, don't know about your script. It's a week later, long enough, the ship has sailed. Yes, I did expect a statement from Harris but maybe he has nothing to say.

Edited by logic - 14/April/2015 at 6:59am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote watcher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14/April/2015 at 8:38am
Originally posted by logic logic wrote:

Had no expectation of an immediate concession (not surrender) while the numbers were in doubt, don't know about your script. It's a week later, long enough, the ship has sailed. Yes, I did expect a statement from Harris but maybe he has nothing to say.


The #2 story on the FPR website for the last week has been "Calderone claims win, Harris not conceding"
Such is life w/ a weekly newspaper without an editor. Statement? The headline remains. Follow-up? Nothing. FROM EITHER SIDE!

Half the voters, and perhaps the candidate, are still stunned and reeling at the last minute bullshit that marked this campaign.

Rather than a concession statement, I'm more interested in MATC's scheme for "Progress".







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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14/April/2015 at 9:31am
Originally posted by watcher watcher wrote:


Half the voters, and perhaps the candidate, are still stunned and reeling at the last minute bullshit that marked this campaign.
This isn't Mayberry, as I'm sure many have noticed. Perhaps omission, pretense and denial are not good tactics when running a campaign. Lily-white would not describe either camp, sorry.

Want to clarify, there are many good people who want to see change in FP. When making reference to "camp", it was an address to the most rabid of supporters on either side.

Edited by logic - 14/April/2015 at 9:57am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote watcher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14/April/2015 at 3:25pm
Originally posted by logic logic wrote:

This isn't Mayberry, as I'm sure many have noticed. Perhaps omission, pretense and denial are not good tactics when running a campaign. Lily-white would not describe either camp, sorry.

Want to clarify, there are many good people who want to see change in FP. When making reference to "camp", it was an address to the most rabid of supporters on either side.


Why would anyone think this time would be different? The both-siderism was cultivated by one-side's bad actors. Just try to look at the evidence objectively. Post-election, the non-winning candidate and supporters are supposed to just go away. MATC & Co. WON! Margins don't matter. Non-conforming views are to be demonized. Vox is EEE-vil and irrelevant. The "Rag-view" isn't worthy to line birdcages. FPF is a handful of lonesome losers and the granddaddy of all EEEEEE-vuls.

Only the FP PAC and Post are unbiased! That's PROGRESS? Keep it going!





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jerry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14/April/2015 at 11:11pm
Logic, earlier you ask if fences can be mended after the election, if you read Sharon Daly's column in the Review the mayor answered that question for you as he went on the attack again. While I did not believe an earlier statement he made in the Review I thought maybe the slap in the face he recieved might have opened his eyes. Tony does not forgive or forget period, it will be business as usual. Watcher, if I am one sides bad actor so be it, I have read the blind peoples garbage for so long I decjdered to fight back. If people really want change in our town then they need to open their eyes not wear blinders like some on this forum do. Tony is not the answer to our problems, just a continuation of them.
 
  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote watcher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15/April/2015 at 9:43am
Originally posted by jerry jerry wrote:

Watcher, if I am one sides bad actor so be it, I have read the blind peoples garbage for so long I decjdered to fight back. If people really want change in our town then they need to open their eyes not wear blinders like some on this forum do. Tony is not the answer to our problems, just a continuation of them.


I'm not sure with whom I'm debating here, but here goes...

I get fighting back. I even get fighting fire with fire, but water typically works better; when properly applied. MATC should not have been the focal point of this election. The village, itself, deserved that position. It remains better than its politics. That you don't see it shows your own blinders.

IMO, Insulting half of its residents was the "both sides" mistake.





Edited by watcher - 15/April/2015 at 9:44am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15/April/2015 at 10:46am
Have a visceral reaction to beatdowns, despise them. An attempt at intimidation whether the focus is Marilyn H, Kathleen K or any other person who dares voice an opinion that differs from our own, is ugly.

I read Sharon's opinion piece this morning, she writes well. Will disagree, the ugly came from "bad actors" on both sides. Even if one doesn't endorse the tactic, it's disingenuous to pretend otherwise. Is a half-truth better than a no truth or a total denial? You be the judge.

I'm pretty sure the Mayor was "sweating bullets" this election season. It takes strength of character, lack of fear to even begin healing long-standing divides. Not endorsing Kelley for D209 was a mistake. In 4 yrs, if he decides to run again, he may be the one refusing to concede:)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15/April/2015 at 11:00am
Originally posted by watcher watcher wrote:

The both-siderism was cultivated by one-side's bad actors. Just try to look at the evidence objectively. Post-election, the non-winning candidate and supporters are supposed to just go away. MATC & Co. WON!
That first sentence is total BS. As to the rest, the ball is in the Mayor's court, either he will or won't. People who NEED to see change will not go away, there may be a very different outcome in 4yrs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote logic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15/April/2015 at 11:54am
Posting of Sharon's opinion piece, can see "David" has become a little more ballsy since his candidate won. Is he's trying to give the Kraken competition for the "King of Mean" title? If so, he's picked the wrong targets.
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